Ep. 2 Mystery Beneath the Ice || Part Two
PART II of Episode 2 “Mystery Beneath the Ice” — Year of the Girl Moss
MICHAELA: If this were my dream, the melting of the ice and being within the ice seems like the tough part, but there’s this one last embrace I’m being called to do, of something that may be uncomfortable or suspicious — and I want to know what that is. I want to know who they are.
I want to get to the other side of this suspicion and discomfort.
SHER: The softness, with what you’re saying—if these are emotions coming up, I assume that when we come back to soft and slow emotions it can feel like there is this barrier of trust. Can I trust these moss creatures? Can I trust these emotions? Can I trust this?
Say she’s in an environment where it is warm and it’s different, or it’s more tropical or that it’s softer and more mushy-gushy. It’s like even being around people that are softer. At first, you’re like, “Is this for real? Are these people actually as soft as they seem?” It can seem suspicious if we’re used to a cold protective terrain, even emotionally.
MICHAELA: Yes, that’s so right on. I completely agree. I mean, if I had to sum up the dream in one sentence, it would be that.
SHER: The questions that came up for me that I would ask her is, “What in your environment could reflect any of these situations in the dream?”
“Is there something strange in your environment? Or different from what you know?” And,
“Are you returning to a certain state or environment, or discovering a new one entirely?” It can feel familiar or foreign, which is a little bit of a feeling like this suspicion around the last few years, like maybe it’s completely different, maybe it’s something she has never known, or it hasn’t been known for a long time.
MICHAELA: Or it’s been buried. In terms of the cosmic age, she said, “I felt like I might have uncovered a cosmic secret,” and like you mentioned before, maybe something that’s been there forever, but it’s just been buried, and forgotten about completely. By many, many, many generations, maybe not even just in “my life, in my experience,” but could have been buried and forgotten about for generations in my family, or generations in the land.
We can dream into the land that we are on, geographically. Sometimes we dream into the land, and the land history, and the land secrets and knowledge. It could be about my life right now, or it could be about the life I’ve inherited through line of ancestry. Or, it could be about the life I’m integrating within my environment. And, possibly, all three of those at the same time.
SHER: Even in the grander collective, with the beginning of this dream, with it being the beginning of Earth itself, and the cycle of seasons. In a way, this dream of hers could also be her glimpse into a cosmic shift, something that’s happening for everyone, but it’s filtered through her own lens. Dreaming is like a disco ball, and you’re one fractal on that disco ball. The colors could be changing for all of us on Earth, but we’re still emitting our own unique light on it. It can be the grander picture into an individual experience, but it can also be that the individual is getting a glimpse of something that is happening to everyone as well. Maybe she’s peeking into what’s happening, and she’s a part of it.
MICHAELA: Yeah, I love that. I love that metaphor, or analogy. It can be, again, like we said in the last episode, dreams can be symbolic and literal at the same time. I think there’s a lot of this.
I do want to note that she said it was one of those dreams, “I felt like I was in an alternate reality.” And that’s really interesting, just as a general comment about dreams and the nature of dreams and different kinds of dreams. In my experience, there are definitely different kinds of dreams that are distinguished based on their emotional content. At least for me, I can tell when a dream is very heavily about me and my subconscious fears and desires and the stresses of the day, and whatnot. They have an emotional signature that’s very telling. And then there are other dreams that are more like this, that feel like I’m in a different place and have a totally different emotional signature. I can’t describe the difference between the emotional signatures. I think that’s something that everybody has to find out and feel for themselves. It’ll be different for everyone and it’ll be unique to each individual. But I definitely understand the feeling of “I went somewhere else.”
I think sometimes we can stay pretty close to our bodies and we’re dreaming within our own energy fields in a more dense way, things that are more obvious, like fears, desires, stresses, anxiety, hopes, etc. And then we can also travel in dreams, and travel into places that are far away from our normal common energy fields. We can go and visit and awaken to deeper layers of reality elsewhere.
The Egyptian word, or the symbol in Egyptian hieroglyphics for dreaming is an open eye, and the translation is to travel and to awaken. In dreams, we travel, and we awaken to other realities, other forms of experience and consciousness.
SHER: My question would be, What are those alternate reality experiences? Have you looked deeper into that? Do people ever ask like, “Well, what does that mean exactly?” Because I think there’s levels of, like you said, metaphor and literal. Have you explored the theory of actually experiencing an alternate reality when we’re having some of these dreams that feel so real?
MICHAELA: I think so. I usually tend to resonate with the Aztec view of alternate realities, as they consider all of it to be dreaming. And I do too. A lot of people like to distinguish like, oh, well, that was astral travel. And that was the land of the dead. And that was the subconscious and that was a psychedelic trip. And that was just the imagination — but for me, it’s all dreaming.
Within that I like to distinguish based on the emotional signature of a place just for my own records. In my experience, in terms of travel to alternate realities, like in the last dream, when we saw a dream of traveling to either the land of the dead, or at least in a neutral middle place between the land of the dead and the land of the living, of which we can communicate with the dead — I would consider that an alternate reality. I have a lot of dreams where I’m in the city I grew up in, but it’s in the turn of the century. I consider that an alternate reality because it’s in a different time. And it’s recurring. I think a lot of people have dreams where they are, say, “in my house,” but it has no actual resemblance to the house I live in. I would consider those alternate realities.
A lot of people have repetitive dream themes, or they’re like a cosmic warrior in a great battle where they need to save people and destroy the dragon and do this etc. It’s very action based and very saga-esque, with weapons and saving something and being a hero and stuff like that.
I consider it another reality — I don’t know if that answers your question.
SHER: Yeah, definitely. I think sometimes when I’m having these discussions, especially with, for example, people in the new age spiritual community, people think of like past lives, then people think all this is actually happening versus metaphorical. And then there’s some people who think that it’s all metaphorical. I was just curious about what you’ve explored and what you’ve learned with all of that or what your perspective on all of it was.
MICHAELA: I also think that dreams are really good at showing us alternate realities in the form of ‘what would have happened if’ or ‘what could happen if,’ as in what happened if I never had — fill in the blank with a big life change — got married, and I have a dream I’m not married to my husband and I have a different life. It’s different in this way and the other, and this parallel version of myself is close to me in a lot of ways, but also is living a totally different life. Maybe they have different skills and abilities, different kinds of knowledge, and I have different knowledge and experience than she does, and we can reach out to each other and exchange.
Dreams can show us alternate life paths. In terms of your question, I do think that linear time is just a perception — it’s a way we perceive, but it doesn’t mean it’s actually how anything’s going on. I think all time is now. I also do think, through dreams as portals, we can influence not only places where we are, but in an alternate timeline, with characters, too, that aren’t necessarily me that I am connected to, who may also be living in alternate timelines, including past times.
If I’m having recurring dreams where I’m in the past, or future, and I’m a different person, playing this character, or dropping in on this character, we’re connected to different characters, archetypes and energies throughout time, so we can access their dreams that they are living in, their experience right now. Whether that seems like the past or future, it is now. We can also access ourselves on alternate timelines, the roads we didn’t take, or could have taken in big life changes, and we can have relationships with those people and characters, and give each other helpful exchanges and different kinds of information, and things like that — be creative with it.
There’s a way to use dream content, and be creative with all dream content, because all dream content has energy for us to utilize. So whether or not any of this is can be proven to be true, I think the more important part is, there’s energy that we can utilize in a positive way and be creative with and use to our advantage, and the advantage to help other people and ourselves, also. You can try it out or not. It doesn’t have to be a belief system. It can all be experimental, and something to experiment for oneself.
Do an action plan, try it out, see what happens. Maybe a synchronicity occurs. You will build your own reality based on the things you try. It doesn’t have to be necessarily faith-based by any means.
SHER: I like that answer — that the energy, and emotional signature is something to utilize. That, in itself, is useful, like therapy. For example, therapy can also transcend a belief system because it’s more of dealing with your emotions and your psyche — like dreams are.
MICHAELA: I would say this dream is an invitation for me to uncover something that is new. I would prefer moss to ice for sure. Even if the moss seems a little suspicious, I think I would prefer the moss to the ice just in general, both aesthetically and to touch and to be in contact with. You still get the water, too, because moss retains water.
SHER: If you think of moss or are encountering moss, you would think it’s a great spot to rest or it’s a nice spot to feel. It’s something that creates a home environment, you would harvest moss for your terrariums, for your animals, because it’s nice for them and their home. But when you encounter ice… we have all these sports, all of these fast activities that take place on ice and snow. It’s showing that contrast. Again, I’m thinking of the slowness that just comes with moss in your environment versus ice and snow.
MICHAELA: Totally and what you said about sports, which is competition; it’s challenging, but fun. No one’s forced into doing ice sports, like, it’s fun, and it’s interesting, but maybe if it were my dream, I am being invited to reveal other aspects of life that could be of use to me now, which is slow and comfortable and homey. Having to do with the heart and emotions, a change of heart, a change of environment. And it doesn’t have to be an outside environment. It can be an internal environmental change.
She said in the background context, that there was this feeling of needing to keep up with everyone. It could be related to me feeling like life has been moving quickly with little downtime. Hmm, yep. Yes. Going across ice; people usually move pretty quickly across ice, whereas the moss is slow and cozy and a place where you might sit down and rest for a while. I would say it’s an invitation, definitely, in this case, like we’ve mentioned before, to rest and relax and be cozy and heart centered.
SHER: And it can feel too good to be true… creating that suspicion. An invitation can almost seem like a temptation at times, like, “Is this okay? I’m being given permission to rest? People around me are having fun? They’re not competing with each other?” Yeah, that can feel a bit strange as well.
MICHAELA: Totally, they’re flying down the mountain, and I’m just gonna sit here and curl up in some moss. That’s what I would prefer, for sure. This is a great dream to do an action plan with because, especially right now in the winter, there’s so much moss around. Find any oak tree, it’s probably covered in moss right now. If this were my dream, I would do two things: I would reenter the dream in my imagination, letting myself slip back into the image and the feelings of the dream and finish it. I have this urge to let this bigfoot moss creature just give me a big ol embrace. I want to be totally embraced by this creature. But of course, do as one will in whatever they feel comfortable with. Maybe they need to ask some questions first about who the moss creature is, or what they have to show them or why they’re here to feel comfortable with being embraced. But for me, I want to be embraced by this moss creature, I want to finish the dream. I want to face my suspicions and see what’s underneath them or beyond my suspicions. And then I would definitely want to bring the energy of this dream into my waking life by doing the obvious, which is gathering Moss from my environment. And doing something creative with it. Like you said, bringing it into the home, putting it on the altar, making a little art piece, decorating my space, even just finding a little clump of moss in the forest and lie down — something.
SHER: I like how you suggested to get some mutual consent with the moss creatures… to ask if it’s safe to embrace them. It’s almost a lovely reminder that this environment that you’re reentering can be real, that it’s something to play with and that it’s open to you, but it’s still a reality that you’re working with. And with that there are energies being exchanged.
MICHAELA: I like talking about doing this, like storytelling around dreams, because it’s fun and interesting to me and it just something I do for pleasure, but in the end what we really want to do is bring the energy of the dream into the waking world and you do that through direct action — intentional action.
Even if my action plan is to go gather some moss, then that’s it. That can be it, and then the dream can come into the waking world with us, and it can continue to evolve alongside of us and speak with us and keep giving us messages and revealing itself little by little now that it’s planted in the world where we have a little bit more awareness and consciousness and mobility, etc.
SHER: I like how you said, “planted.” It’s making me think of how dream journaling is the first layer, how dream journaling solidifies the world so that you can have clear dreams, but that the second layer of that cake is bringing those elements into our world so that those elements particularly can continue communicating with us and serve us. There’s a deeper way of working that. I think that’s something I don’t think about often that I think you encourage and remind me of, like I’m so I’m focusing on the dream and I love the dream. I’m in awe of the dream. But you remind me to actually take it one step further. “How can I explore these symbols? What action can I take? How can I invite it into my life versus just speculating about it?”
MICHAELA: Yeah, totally. Because it is vital energy we’re working with! And in terms of Robert Moss, this is his entire practice. It’s called active dreaming. This is what sets his practice apart from other people and psychology. Just leaving it in the realm of psychology or therapy or talk therapy is fine. And it’s great. But this is really the meat of the practice. A lot of people are interested in lucid dreaming, but this is lucid dreaming just in the waking world first. So lucid dreaming is dragging our waking consciousness into the dreaming world so we can have that experience. This is dragging dreaming consciousness into our waking world first, so we can have that experience. Again, it’s building a land bridge between the waking and the dreaming so that we can travel across it, so that our consciousness can travel. Then we can travel from waking to dreaming and dreaming to waking. And with this, starting in the waking world where we have some better ability to set intentions. In the dreaming world we’re often just on autopilot.
In the waking world we have more ability to set intentions, so why not start by bringing the dream into the waking world? Eventually, once that bridge has been built, our waking consciousness can travel into the dreaming, and we can have that experience of a lucid dream.
I think that’s why Robert — one of his first books was called conscious dreaming and he doesn’t really use the term lucid dreaming — he says conscious dreaming. My interpretation of that, that means dreaming in the waking world first and foremost.
SHER: When you were talking about building a bridge, I was thinking of two things: Where the Wild Things Are. I don’t know it too well, just briefly, but I know he’s exploring the woods with these giant creatures. And also Bridge to Terabithia is a story with kids going into the woods and finding a magical place. Also, I think of Eden, and the essence of green. All of these keep connecting back to building a bridge to a place where it feels very pure, that imagination can really expand and reign free. Where life can seem more magical than it is, like awakening the heart of creativity, and connection to all things.
MICHAELA: I love that. I might have to go build a moss creature for myself.
SHER: I was thinking that too. I feel so called by this incentive, almost a need to take items from this because it feels like a collective reawakening back to the heart and child essence. I feel collectively people wanting to tap back into their innocence and really embracing their innocence.
MICHAELA: Yeah, that goes back to even the cosmic story, or the worldly story of tapping back into Eden or paradise or childtime, before there’s winter, before we need clothes, before we needed to hunt — all of these things we need to do in order to survive are because of the winter, otherwise we’re in the tropics, and food grows everywhere, and you don’t really need clothes and you don’t really need shelter as much. It’s a much easier, more laid back, warm and slow lifestyle. Winter brought a lot of harsh harshness into the human experience. Being able to melt away that harshness and challenge of having to fight to survive, having to collect resources and hoard them and make sure everything’s okay… Letting that go, letting it melt away, and coming back to this ease, softness and slowness of living.
SHER: And when you come from a cooler environment, like I grew up in the Midwest, and the first time I made a big move was to Southern California, I did notice a massive shift in people’s personalities and their way of living life. I remember going over there and all I ever wore was boots so I didn’t even own a pair of sandals, and I saw everyone wearing sandals all the time — and managers would be late! That was so foreign to me. And when you see people who surf or grew up in southern california, playful, and more present lifestyle. And sometimes very external. Say you place someone from New York City into SoCal, they’re going to look around and think, ‘These people are lazy,’ and ‘I don’t trust these people,’ you know?
The way of life we’ve built for ourselves, when we go back into the garden of Eden we might not even accept it right away. We might actually go into a utopian society and be like, ‘These people are weird — and I don’t trust them.’
All the utopian stories are like that. Where they’re depicted to be a bit strange. Like in Brave New World, for example, or The Island by Aldous Huxley. He projected utopian societies to be ‘not good.’ He felt that is was kind of sucking life out — but that’s the thing, our art and a lot of our way of life was created in a harsh environment that we’ve come to idolize, with intensity and toughness as virtues or values that we want to have and live by — that it somehow creates a good person.
MICHAELA: True. And there is something to be said about that — restriction and limits forces creativity. The more limited we are, it forces creativity and innovation. Otherwise, why bother? You can just enjoy things. All of a sudden we have limits in our lives… it can tie into the Saturn Return concept. Saturn being a planet of restriction and limitation and how when it’s presented to us it seems like ‘Oh no! I have less money. I lost this relationship. I don’t have a car anymore’ — all these limitations, forces creativity. That is the positive aspect of restriction and limitation.
If this were my dream, placing it in a time in my life where I’ve just been through those forced limitations and restrictions and maybe that phase of being restricted to promote creativity and life changes and paths that are more aligned with me — Maybe that challenging time is coming to a close and melting away. The new life that is underneath that is coming up to the surface. Maybe I’m used to being challenged and I’m suspicious of something that seems different, looking to be embraced or acknowledged, or played with in some way.
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